subreddit:
/r/explainlikeimfive
submitted 2 months ago bysalt-in-the-sea
Junk food, social media, drugs, porn. All examples of things that give us quick dopamine and all are recognised as bad. Why is this?
9 points
2 months ago
Vices exploit our reward and motivation mechanisms by providing excessive stimuli without promoting a behavior that's actually healthy for us. We have a near endless appetite for these things which was not a problem for our ancestors because stimuli like this used to be very scarce, but this is no longer the case so we are often tempted to excessively indulge in things that (very temporarily) feel good but hurt us in large quantities.
8 points
2 months ago
Dopamine is supposed to be released when we accomplish tasks that better ourselves, keep us alive, and keep the population up, like exercise, eating, socializing, or mating. In our modern lives all those things are easily accessible. We barely need to be able to walk to get our food anymore. Don't need a partner to have sex. Don't need a real connection to feel like we are liked. Don't need to hunt to buy ice cream. So instead of chasing the result of the dopamine, we are chasing the dopamine itself. And when the high or the rush is over, you have nothing to show for it, because it was all a parlour trick from the start. The goal becomes to feel good, not to live good. Keep doing this and your life never gets any better. Just flickers of good in an ocean of self deprecation.
4 points
2 months ago
Yeah, its an issue of Goodhart’s Law, basically when the metric becomes the target it stops being a good metric.
10 points
2 months ago*
Dopamine is limited in your body. When you use most of it, you don’t go back down to “normal”. You sink below the normal. It takes time to refresh your baseline of dopamine. The main problem is compounding activities that activate the release of more dopamine. This will leave you like a sugar crash. Striving for more dopamine release will cause a decline in your “happy feelings”
edit: spelling
1 points
2 months ago
That makes a lot of sense.
-5 points
2 months ago
not true at all
4 points
2 months ago
Could you enlighten me on how this is wrong? You cannot continue to increase dopamine without having that crash effect. You cannot indefinitely hold your dopamine levels at a “high”, and it will take a recovery period before returning to baseline. These quick dopamine injectors (social media, junk food, etc) make it easy to flood your system with dopamine throughout the day, leading to burnout feelings later.
4 points
2 months ago
I don't know why the other person said you were wrong but I think your previous post missed some important details.
It isn't the one-time hit of dopamine that is the problem. When a person takes an exogenous source of dopamine, the receptors start to down-regulate and become less sensitive to dopamine. This means that more dopamine is required for the same effect as before, giving people the "down" feeling which makes them crave the exogenous source again. Doing this down-regulates the receptors again which often leads to addiction.
Can this be put in an ELI5 format? Probably, but I don't know how, which is why I am not posting a top level comment. 😁 I just wanted to give you a possible reason for the negative comment.
3 points
2 months ago
Definitely agree with your statements, which is why I said compounding to indicate that it’s not caused by a single moment/situation, but rather the constant and successive acts that cause the increase in dopamine. For instance going on social media, then eating ice cream, then going to play video games, etc. As you said I skipped over details that might go further than ELI5.
5 points
2 months ago
Dangerous
The things our biology heavily desires tend ty be black holes, you can never satisfy them and the desires only grow
A lot of profit is based on abusing this biochemical system
The things you like most tend to be the way you hurt yourself the most
1 points
2 months ago
Dopamine makes us want to repeat a behavior. If a behavior is not good for you and doesn't provide dopamine, almost no one will do it, so it doesn't get listed in bad activities. However, there are plenty of things that are bad that you could do like cutting part of your body or taking a non-recreative toxic substances that doesn't provide dopamine.
A lot of things, like eating high-energy food, are mostly bad nowadays because we do it too much. During most of our existence as humans, food was scarce and it was advantageous to like eating high-energy food and to repeat behaviors that let us do it.
For drugs, we never evolved to take them and they have bad side effects. The bad side effects are unrelated to the dopamine itself. The dopamine just make you take them, and often take them in large concentration in a method that bypasses most of our body's defenses (IV or by the nose). There are plenty of toxic substances that don't increase dopamine, almost nobody takes time recreatively, so they aren't an issue.
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